Exro CEO & Leadership Q&A Session

September 28, 2022

At a Glance

Exro CEO and leadership team answer shareholder questions in this live update. This live stream took place at Exro's Calgary Manufacturing Facility. This event included:

  • Sue Ozdemir - Chief Executive Officer
  • Eric Hustedt - Chief Technology Officer
  • Josh Sobil - Chief Commercial Officer
  • John Meekison - Chief Financial Officer
  • Darrell Bishop - President of Finance & Investor Relations
Exro CEO & Leadership Q&A Session


Sue Ozdemir: Another live update, from Calgary this time. And so again, for those of you that are joining us for one of our live updates for the first time, these are truly live. They are not pre-edited. They are not pre-recorded. We are sitting here in our boardroom. Behind us you can see our clean room, which is currently being commissioned on our first line. And for the first time I'm sitting here with some of our executive team to share with you the great people that are helping to build your company. So, for today what I'm going to do is, we're going to keep it almost like a panel, fireside. We've got an overwhelming amount of questions from every platform. We were trying to be completely transparent, so you can find most of those on our website under the Events tab. If you click on the little piece that says Events page, you can see all the questions that came in. We're going to keep it to about an hour today because there was well over a hundred questions. That was a portion of what we received. We got others through our IR site, through direct messaging to somebody that sits here on the panel. And so, what we're going to do is we've grouped them together, we're going to try to cover everything, we're going to let you keep sending in questions if you have more after today. Keep sending them on in and then the team will come together, and we'll put them all up on the website under the Q&A section. So right now, I'm going to turn it over to Darrell. I think a lot of our shareholders know Darrell but for those of you who don't, Darrell is the president of our IR and Finance team and so he's going to mediate the panel for us. He's going to throw out the questions and group them together, and we're just going to keep it fun, live, and real for you all. And maybe we can introduce each other as we go too, Darrell.

Darrell Bishop: Sure. Yeah, thanks Sue. And first of all, thank you to all of our shareholders for being on this call and for the support. We know it's a very tough market out there. I think you can see that in the questions that were submitted a couple of common themes throughout the questions that we tried to lump in to answer as many as possible here. And I hope you'll see as we go through, we're not filtering these questions. We're keeping the hard questions in and at the forefront because we want to make sure we have transparency to our shareholder group. And so, it's really lumped down into a handful of buckets: really from a strategy perspective, certainly from a finance perspective, and then also interests from our products from a commercial perspective, and also just the tech in general, and then some fun questions that were thrown out there. So, you do have a couple of admirers from a shareholder perspective and I don't think they've met your husband, who's a third-degree black belt and he's a wall of muscle. So just be careful with your questions. But we'll jump right in here. First question. And anybody can answer these. What do you think the executive team could be doing better from a leadership standpoint and what objections does your team receive from partners?

Sue Ozdemir: So, I think from a leadership perspective-look, there's always things that we can be doing better as a leadership team, and we never take that for granted. So, I think right now, I think we're doing everything to the best of our abilities and what we need to do better is just continue to improve our messaging, continue to improve how we communicate to all of you, why we're so excited about what's happening behind the doors. And then from a partnership perspective I don't think that there is something that we need to improve. Josh is going to talk today about how overwhelming we've been getting in requests, and we really don't have any negativity coming from the commercial side of the business. So that's where I'd go for that one, Darrell.

Darrell Bishop: With respect to the facilities, one of the- we're sitting in here-we're making large Investments on behalf of our shareholders. How can we reassure shareholders that we are on the right track, and this is the right time to make those investments?

Sue Ozdemir: So, I understand that from a shareholder perspective it's really hard to wrap your head around why we've made such an investment into this facility, but I think for us we sit here in this facility, in particular where it was a cement floor and no walls. And we look around and we see what we saw two and a half years ago with supply chain issues that were going to happen and how do we participate not only in bringing great tech to the market but in being a true North American supply chain. And we see things in the US now with the new IRA Act and we know that that is just going to make us have another piece of a differentiating technology. So not only do we have this great, market-leading technology but we have the ability to supply it in North America next year. And that is a huge jump and a huge statement to the vision that we had and the support that you all gave us to be able to execute this vision.

John Meekison: And I'll just add a little bit to that. I think it's important for investors to know that as Josh here is working on getting more orders and for our company, we need to be ready as a company from a manufacturing capacity to be able to deliver on those orders. So, you need to put that infrastructure in before so that we can meet the demand when it comes.

Eric Hustedt: And I guess one other point would be, it gives us a specific process capabilities that we require for our products basically and it allows us to control those. So that's just all-around good work in my mind.

Darrell Bishop: Excellent. Well, it's a good segue. And just so everybody knows, these were not scripted. We're actually going through this for the first time. So, it segues in actually nicely to the next question which is: When do you expect production and more significant revenue from Exro?

Sue Ozdemir: So, we are on schedule as per our last update for Q3 production of next year. We're still targeting maybe a little bit of a squeeze early on the battery control, the new Cell Driver, which you've seen our announcement about today. And just a great job by Josh and Eric and all of the team to pull that across the finish line. But we have no delays on production right now and so we're just going to keep tracking, keep pushing, keep going. We have all of our critical components to be able to build so we don't foresee any huge supply chain issues with that on the long-term items. So, we feel like we've really managed that and we're on track for that bigger revenue and just keep building. And so, we're in that home stretch.

Darrell Bishop: Okay and purling into that, obviously we're building these facilities. There are people that are required to operate them and bring our tech to market. There are a few questions around us hiring and hiring staff before we get these orders. What's your take on that?

Sue Ozdemir: Right. So, I think we have to take one step back too because we're in this whole new world with social media. You can go online, and you can read all kinds of things and you can start to imagine that we're hiring hundreds of people, sometimes it's a day and sometimes people think it's a week. And there's a great country song that talks about the days where you could do things and it wouldn't be out in social media. So, I think that what we want to remember is that Exro's philosophy since day one, when I joined the company, has always been to focus on hiring the right people that build our company. And so, it's not about the roles, it's about the people. And we interview 50+ people for some roles before that one person is picked. And so, for sure there's roles that you see all the time on our website, like software engineers, because we never have too many software engineers is the best way to put it. We can always have a great software engineer but we're not just out hiring the first person that applies. And so, to sum that up, you'll see that the roles have started to decline a little bit because we've been able to really secure all of our engineering team. We have some great squad leads. We have some great software leads. We have a great President of Engineering, that's all working under Eric's leadership, that allow us to execute. Same with Josh's team. We've got great salespeople now. We've got great commercial ops. We've got a great application team. On the finance team, the same thing. We've built that core team up for us to execute for the next three to five years. So, there will be more roles, especially as the production gets up and running and as the EVS team out in Detroit continues to bring in more projects and products to market. But for the most part, we've got that core leadership in that core company that it just allows us to really accelerate into the next few years.

Josh Sobil: And if I can just add to that, on the orders perspective. We need the right people in order to get those orders. So, enabling us to actually have the right discussion points, have the right engineering, have the right support for us to go out and then win those orders, it does have to be the right people. So that's definitely part of it. So, the core team.

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah. And again, as Eric's going to talk to you, I'd go back to-remember, we are not creating standard products. We are not creating the next iPhone. We are not creating the next walk. We're creating something that essentially is replacing what's in the market today. And that requires a really complicated puzzle of people that make it come to market. It's not just the tech. Tech can sit on the table and never go anywhere. And so, we've really been focused over the last 18 months on putting those people in place for this next stage of the business.

Darrell Bishop: It's a good segue again into the next question, which I'm going to put John and myself in the hot seat this time with respect to our recent capital rates. So why the amount that we raise and what's our plan to fund the business to cash flow positive?

John Meekison: Perfect. So let me take part of that and I'll turn it over to you Darrell to add a little color around it. So what keeps Darrell and I up at night, in fact, is making sure that Exro is adequately capitalized, particularly when you think about the uncertainty in the marketplace that's going on right now and also in the world events. So, one of the things that we wanted to do was strike when the iron was hot and be able to raise a sufficient amount of capital to get us through some meaningful milestones over the next few months here. And we wanted to get in front of a number of other financings that we suspect were going to be coming through in the fall, so timing was particularly important. What we try to do and as we think through these financings is we're always weighing off the costs of dilution to shareholders and, as we are all shareholders here as well, it's important to us to factor that in. And so, the equation that we wrestle with is how much money do we take in? What's the pricing? And so, in our minds, doing a small fundraising of about 10 million dollars that we specifically targeted to existing shareholders was a key financial catalyst that allows us to get through the next upcoming news events and catalysts that we expect will be unfolding over the course of Q4. So, we did that, we executed on that. Are we happy with the share price in terms of...? No. There's a lot of frustrated shareholders here in this room as well. But we feel very good that we've capitalized the company on a go forward basis. Now, our job is not done. We have to look forward and yes, this company, Exro as a technology company, will absolutely need to raise more capital down the road. So now the shifting is towards how do we do that in a non-dilutive way? How can we raise more capital through sources that don't impact the share capital dilution? So that's the strategy that Darrell and I are working on and is keeping us up at night.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah, and thanks for that, John. And we have a lot of options, like really when you look at where we are from a technology perspective, the technology has been de-risked, we have it in working vehicles, either Exro demos or customer vehicles where we are right now. And so, funding that next leg to our production is, we're looking at strategics, we're looking at non-dilutives. We have our letter of acceptance to NASDAQ which we'll speak about. But when we talk about raising capital, that doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to have an opportunity to participate in such a deal like that. So every decision we make we're making with the best interests of shareholders and what the future value of the shares that you hold today are going to hold as we build out our revenue profile here over the coming years.

Sue Ozdemir: And I think it's also a good opportunity to just say, thank you to all of you as shareholders, like all of you, all of our Exro employees, are shareholders. We feel the same frustration. We wish the same things for when we go out to do capital raises and what we can bring in for the company, and we do do that over a long-term strategy of how we're going to do it. It's not a crystal ball that we can just go out and say we want it to execute this way, or we would have had a different result there. But what I think is important is that our shareholders, our company employees are working really hard to build that value for all of us and it's not an employee versus shareholder. It's all of us together that are making this company be able to reach the goal that we know is just ahead of us right now.

Darrell Bishop: On the shareholder note, there has been some recent insider selling, John, so I'll put you in the hot seat there. What's your take on that?

John Meekison: Sure, yeah. So, the backdrop to that actually-you have to zoom away from the specific mechanics and processes-was that there was about approximately about a million stock options that were about to expire over the course of September and into October. So that actually dovetailed right into the middle of financing. So, one of the things that you saw is, actually with all that trading that was going on, was those options being exercise and we've actually cleaned out that overhang as of now. But I think what is important actually to point out to investors is that actually when you step back and you look through the noise at the end of the day, all those shareholders-and myself included in that-if you look at our CD reports on a before-and-after you'll see that all of us have increased our Exro shareholding. So, for example, since about the beginning of September to now my actual shareholdings have doubled.

Darrell Bishop: Great. And I also participated in the recent financing and have been buying stock in the market. So you can check the CD reports for insiders. Sue, question came in regarding your board work at Naqi and how do you have time to work at Exro, focused, and on the board of Naqi as well?

Sue Ozdemir: So now I don't. So recently-I did, as we were in a different stage. So, I have recently resigned from my position with Naqi and I'm going to be focused on boards that support what we're doing with Exro. Naqi's a great company. And I was very privileged to be able to participate in where I was and I am very thankful for Mark and the group there to let me participate in that, and to learn more to help myself in Exro. And as we progressed and Naqi progressed, it was just natural. So, I actually am off the Naqi board officially. I do serve on another board, which is the NEMA organization, and I am the chair of the Automotive Component Council, and so all of that is really working around trade organizations that will help Exro to spread our message, that we can change the status quo on electrification. And what we see today is not what we're going to see in five years for a powertrain or for how a battery is used. And so, my time will be focused around those opportunities that allow Exro to really take its place in the market and to become a market leader like I've envisioned over the past three years. So, thanks, Darrell.

Darrell Bishop: Thank you. The next question, it's ironic because the only time we ever really talk about this is panels like this, but John, can you provide an update or any information on the patent infringement?

John Meekison: Right, sure. So, unfortunately patent litigation is an issue that a lot of technology companies just have to deal with at some point or time in their growth phase. It's just a part of the business. The also unfortunate part of that is that we really can't talk a lot about what's going on. Litigation by nature needs to be done under the covers. And I know it's frustrating for people who are thirsting for information of what's going on. But let me leave you with a couple of nuggets related to that. The first thing I think I would point out to everybody is that litigation in no way has deterred our discussions with current or prospective customers slash collaboration partners. So, yes, they want to understand and know about this. And so, we ended up having a dialogue around it, but in almost every case, in fact, I think every case we've had we get past that, and we move on, and the discussion becomes "Okay, how can we work together?" So, I think that investors can take comfort in the fact that it's certainly in no way hindering our ability to be able to interact with partners and collaborators. So that's a good thing. The second thing that I would also point out is when we look at this, we try to look at risk exposure, and what is the downside of all this as well. And I think what would be-and this is public information-what would be important to point out is that the ePropelled patent question that is the subject of this litigation, it actually expires in the fall of 2024. So, from that perspective, I think you as an investor can start to think about what is the limitations around that kind of exposure? So again, it's frustrating. I would say, trust the process. We have a great, great patent litigation team working with us. There will be milestones coming up, which I suspect some of you may see coming up on various dockets. And these points, more information will become public and so let's stay tuned. But it is part of the process, and we are highly confident as well as our collaborators that we're going to get through all of this.

Darrell Bishop: Thank you, John. I'm going to-full pun intended-I'm going to switch gears into our products and some of the relationships. First question, probably for you Sue: Was any part of SEA's relationship (SEA Electric) with Exro at all contingent on Exro's investment in SEA Electric? And are you considering selling the equity stake in SEA at some point in the future?

Sue Ozdemir: So, no, it's not contingent. The relationship with SEA is based on the ability for Tony as their CEO to really see the vision of what is coming in the industry and how upfitters, in particular, deal with that transition as more OEMs come on with full product. And wanting to make sure that he continues to be a differentiator in the segment. And so, it's really driven by the potential that we can bring to improve gradeability, to improve component cost, to improve total cost of ownership for fleet operators. And we've never lost the focus on that. And while there is delay that partnership remains as strong as it was 18 months ago, if not a little bit more so now today that we can show those results. And then from a divesting-look, it was a great investment that continues to be a great investment for us. I need to be focused on what we can do with Exro. So, while we don't have that conversation ongoing now, it is public that SEA is looking to go public sometime next year. And so, we're very supportive of helping them to make that next journey in their company, and very optimistic that that means that we're going to be able to make some moves next year that help us to get back some of that investment. But there's no plans to do that today.

Darrell Bishop: With respect to our technology, obviously it's a game changer, differentiator, from a performance perspective. Given those claims-"claims" people wrote-how are we making headway with the larger automotives?

Sue Ozdemir: You start, Josh.

All: [laughter]

Josh Sobil: So, I think, first of all, the important thing to point out I think here is that those larger automotive companies are very much focused on the long-term program developments. So, the sales cycle time to go into some of these automotive programs is quite long. What I will say is that we are very much engaged with several larger partners, larger Tier 1s. And I think this is known out there, that we are definitely focused on that as a long term. So, this is our longer-range forecast in terms of where we want to go with our revenue and where we want to go with our revenue makeup. So, our pipeline very much includes what I would call those larger partners. The product-and I think we'll talk a little bit about the generic versus the customized ones at some point here, because I do want to get into that-their early revenue is more about some of these more generic products that can go into more standard applications. And those are really designed to fill a vacuum where some of the bigger players might be vacating the space right now, looking after some bigger fish, where we can come in. And we are focused definitely in this two-pronged approach. And so larger partners, definitely obviously Linamar is our biggest one right now. And it's something that we've had a really positive journey with them, I'll call it. And I'm sure we're going to talk a lot more about Linamar as we go forward here, that's going to be a definite focal point. But they are, let's say a channel or a vector into a lot of those bigger automotive partners as well. So, the progress that we make with someone like Linamar, then it basically puts us into a really good position with a lot of the automotive partners. So, you have to think about how we are building out that strategy and how what we're doing now really gives us that channel and that vector into those bigger automotive partners. But yes, we're seeing progress and as the technology matures, we're seeing a lot more feedback and we're getting things really moving.

Sue Ozdemir: And remember, if we look back Josh joined just slightly after me in November of 2019. So, if we look back Josh, in 2019, we were looking for partners like Linamar that could prove that the tech worked and so as we brought in Eric and were developing that and now that's all de-risked, and we know that the tech works. There's no question in any of our minds that the tech works. So, the type of partner that we're looking for now is not a partner that helps us to prove that the tech works. It's a partner that helps us take it to mass production. So, Josh, if you look at-I'm going to throw in a question now.

All: [laughter]

Josh Sobil: Okay, here we go.

Sue Ozdemir: If you look at the percentage of your pipeline, how many of them are working on a one-time sale versus a multi-year contract?

Josh Sobil: Oh, 90% is mostly this sort of recurring revenue stream, where we're looking at multi-year, what I would call long-term purchase agreements. So, if you're setting up an OEM, you want to purchase a powertrain. You're not going to do it on a batch process. You're going to look at it for over say a three- or four-year program. Even if it is more of a standardized product that you're putting into the marketplace, you're going to want to pick your powertrain. It's a significant portion. You're going to want to de-risk that as much as you can. So often what we're looking to do is set up what I would call master purchase agreements or master sales agreements.

Sue Ozdemir: MSAs.

Josh Sobil: Whatever you might call them, it depends on the acronym, depends on the company basically. But the idea there is that they can de-risk their powertrain, especially when you look at the supply chain issues that are going on right now. For us that's an advantage. So, we can, I mentioned the vacuum that we can fill right now. There's a lot of turmoil out there and so us being able to produce and actually bring something-that, in and of itself, is an advantage for a lot of our customers. Just being able to supply. So, us coming on, we're filling that void. And this is, I would say, a really great opportunity obviously for us to look at the long term and the pipeline, how we build that out. But our customers are also looking to de-risk and build in a long-term pipeline. So, I think, in terms of the anatomy of a deal, I think maybe that's important for investors to understand too, that this is a recurring revenue stream that we're really going after on a year-by-year basis with each one of our partners.

Darrell Bishop: With respect to partners in Tier 1, we've made some potential commitments to adding more strategic partners. What are your thoughts on adding a second Tier 1 strategic partner by end of year this year?

Sue Ozdemir: So, Josh is looking like…

All: [laughter]

Josh Sobil: You're looking at Sue and then she's looking at me.

Sue Ozdemir: So absolutely we made a commitment that we're going to sign an additional strategic partner before the end of this year. I think we've long said it's not a guarantee. We are public, so we want to make sure that we make that very clear. But Josh and the team are along where we have that gut feel. We've been at this for a long time in commercial sales that we're in a good position to be able to say that's on track for happening at the end of this year. And so, I think we've got a good handful that are getting through those kinds of stages that we want. The tech is there where we want it to be. And so, as we sit today, we're on track to do that. And hopefully even outperform on what we do for that.

Josh Sobil: And I think you want to-just to add to that-you want to make sure you pick the right partner.

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah.

John Meekison: Yes.

Josh Sobil: And that we have the right strategic alignment between those partners. So yes, our target is absolutely and we're talking to several that now we could. But it's something that I think we have to always make sure that we're picking the right one that lines up with our pipeline and strategic initiatives.

Sue Ozdemir: I actually think that's a great add, Josh. So, I think we throw a lot of cliché words, but if I think about a sustainable business and how we get like-what does 23, 24, 25, 26, what does 2030 look like? I think that that comes to the partners that we pick today. And so, as we look to the partners that we picked, we started with partners that helped us to get really smart and how our product was a differentiator for a specific segment. So how Zero helped us to look at how it helps with a race bike or how SEA helped us to look at how it looks like with a fleet vehicle. But now we've evolved into-and we're growing up. And so, we're looking at a company that now we have to think about how do we use our resources, our critical resources in engineering, and in production, in supply chain, and in money, and make sure that the partners that we pick do more than just encourage us for what's coming. They actually bring us future business that-while I understand it's really frustrating from the outside in and I continue to say I wish that you could all come and sit here, everybody could sign an NDA, but then we'd be in a different issue-

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: But for us it's pretty easy when we have an NDA to-and I don't mean because the customer. I mean, because the information that we can give that customer is different than we can give out to the public. So, as we sit and are able to do that as a team, I think it really is for us about picking the right partner. And I think that is a great add.

Darrell Bishop: And Linamar's been a great partner for us.

Sue Ozdemir: Fantastic partner.

Darrell Bishop: They're a fantastic company and group of engineers and management there. Can you give an update with respect to the e-axle delivery, the prototype?

Josh Sobil: Yeah, so-

Sue Ozdemir: Go ahead, Josh.

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: Josh is the one that's close. He's the one that brought in Linamar.

Josh Sobil: So yeah, with Linamar right now we're working-basically, the drive is in good shape and Eric can discuss about our L40. It's going through testing right now and the motor that we've developed with Linamar is basically going to be tested here in the next month or so. And that's going to be what we validate with them. So, everything is looking very positive, I guess I would say, from a performance standpoint on the drive right now. And I think, yeah, anything to add on to that from a testing perspective?

Eric Hustedt: No, the drive's fully operational, it's been running in full current on temperature measurements and all that sort of stuff. So, the drive is fine. We've had a small delay on the motor I guess is really what it comes down to.

Sue Ozdemir: So, the reason-just for you shareholders that don't know-the reason we can say the drive is working fine is because, again, the drive is agnostic to motor type. So we can test that drive on a motor like our TSA motor or a different motor. I don't know which one we've tested it on. All of the above?

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: We've tested on a bunch of motors. And we can gain a lot of confidence to how it's going to perform on that specific motor that is unique to Linamar's powertrain. And so as we wait for that, it's like a final checkbox that we need to make. But there's no risk that says, "oh it's going to go on that motor and it's going to blow up." And so as we're talking to that, I just want to make sure that you all understand why we're seeing it that way. And so, yes, there's a couple of weeks where the motor was supposed to be in, I think two weeks ago, and now it's going to be at the beginning of October. And there's little supply chain things that we're working, but it doesn't prevent us from progressing from the core Exro technology part, the Coil Driver.

Darrell Bishop: And Linamar, obviously, they launched this eLIN e-axle division four or five months ago?

Sue Ozdemir: I think eLIN is over a year now.

Darrell Bishop: Okay. But they rolled out the initial prototype at the ACT show. Two, three weeks ago, they announced a supply agreement with Workhorse Group out of the US. And so, Sue, what can you tell us about the relationship between that e-axle and Workhorse Group and where our product comes?

Sue Ozdemir: So, I'd say first as somebody who drives, we want to make sure that Tier 1s and auto manufacturers are really thinking about reliability and safety. So, I commend Linamar for looking to Exro and seeing this next generation tech, but also staying true to their Tier 1 nature and making sure that the product that they put into the finished product is safety tested, reliable and achievable for their long term. So, they've long said that we are what they consider the next generation for the eBeam axle. We're on track for all of that. Nothing's changed. They have an incumbent that's basically supplying them today. And so, what I would say is that in the future I would see us being that supplier because we're going to deliver as we promised. We have no doubt it's going to do what we say it's going to do. And Linamar, again, has been a fantastic partner, customer, and helped us to take it through the development to where it is today.

John Meekison: And I think it's fair to say that on the back of that and I'll turn over to Josh, I'll ask another question too.

All: [laughter]

John Meekison: We can see other initiatives emerge from the same strategic partners. We're not necessarily tied to one specific project.

Josh Sobil: Yeah, it's a good point actually. So, I mentioned earlier with the larger automotive partners, companies like Linamar, why they're so important is because they can amplify our presence in that marketplace. So not just-I know it's easy to focus just on eBeam axle, but Linamar supplies a lot of other companies with a lot of other e-axles or three-in-one drive units. So that's not to say that that's the only program that Linamar may basically enable us to [inaudible].

Darrell Bishop: I'm going to keep you talking, Josh.

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: Can you give an update on some of our partnerships? Lots of questions around Zero, Potencia. Just in general, what's your take from a commercial perspective?

Josh Sobil: Yeah, sure. So again, with Zero I would say right now we're going through-we've completed the technical valuation, we're talking now more from a commercial standpoint of what's the next step that we go into. There's a lot of developments happening with the company. They're next generation in their direction of where they take their bikes. And so, we are now in those discussions with them. And yes, it's taken a long time, but again they are a longer sales cycle type program business. So, it's not something that is a drop-in replacement. We have to look at engineering it to order to make sure that it can go into-and then again, it's a long-term, recurring type program, so we have to look at the long term with them. With Potencia, more of a standard product, more generic product that we can work on with them. We are going through the final validation steps with them and getting the vehicle up and running. And we're actually looking at some higher voltage options with them too, so they are expanding their product portfolio. What's exciting about Potencia is, I think, that they show a more diverse range here of upfitters and conversion vehicles, these types of things, that can give us a better presence in that space as well and again be almost an amplifier there for us as well. So, in that sense, there's a strategic alignment there with Potencia and there's a lot of potential.

Sue Ozdemir: And it's also a different market for us too because that's the South American market versus the North American market.

Josh Sobil: And it's a different market, exactly. Exactly, from a geography standpoint. And then to look at some of the other partnerships and where we're going. What I'm actually pretty excited about is we've been getting a lot of interest in what we're doing, and our standard products are showing a lot of promise. We've designed them, like I said, to fill a bit of a void or a vacuum that we're seeing in the marketplace, and so we've grouped them together and we're seeing this traction now for-no pun intended.

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: Coil Driver is also known as a traction inverter for anybody who-

Josh Sobil: Traction builders and traction inverters for those that aren't tuned in necessarily. But it's something that we're seeing. We need to get the product over the line and be able to produce it. This is, I think, what we're seeing and then that's what everybody's hair is on fire now, like working on right now, Eric especially here. Not to put him on the spot.

All: [laughter]

Josh Sobil: We're also seeing-we're getting pretty optimistic. We've seen some real potential in some different applications even. So, what I can say is some optimism in the world of hybrids and some of these other applications, where we weren't necessarily focused, we're seeing some real promise in the Coil Driver. So, broadening the approach of applications that we can go to-and this is still in the traction space-is also showing some real promise. So, from the partners that we're working on, those two specifically, like I said, I gave the update. And then I think we've got some others that, like we said, are under NDA. More on the commercial EV space, where we see a lot of our revenue pipeline build up coming in is also where I'm really excited, where I see a lot of potential.

Darrell Bishop: Awesome. Eric-

Eric Hustedt: Oh.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah, I'm going to put you in the-one of the areas, even from an investor perspective, we've been getting a lot of attention from is our high voltage drive and an ability to AC fast charge. Can you give a rundown from your perspective on the benefits of fast charging?

Eric Hustedt: Right. So, the Coil Driver natively is a bi-directional power converter, right. So, it'll take single phase AC, take three phase AC, it'll take DC actually, direct from a solar panel, enable you to charge your vehicle without any extra infrastructure, essentially. So, you'd take the AC line straight into the vehicle and allows you to charge the battery. So, it dramatically reduces the infrastructure costs, it reduces the cost for the vehicle manufacturer. They don't have to include on-board chargers. It's natively V2X. So, the vehicle expands the operational capabilities of large fleet vehicles because you can now act as an energy storage when the vehicle stationary. So, I think the AC charging is a very useful and great addition to the Coil Driver functionality basically because it makes the functionality of that thing very, very useful and just massive reduction infrastructure costs. I guess I should be looking at the camera.

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: It's all good.

Josh Sobil: I was doing the same thing.

Sue Ozdemir: And for Josh and the team, it's a differentiator from a total cost of ownership perspective for those fleet operators. So now they can drive down not only the onboard charger cost, which can go upwards of $2500-even some price points have been over $5000-but also that infrastructure cost. And that goes back to the NEMA Association that I serve on and different people on our team participate in different councils and different trade organizations as we lobby to make sure that we think about, as people, as a society, we think about how we're charging, what the infrastructure is. Is it really range anxiety? Or is it how the infrastructure is built? And from a fleet operator perspective, if a fleet operator with 10 vehicles can now spend $10,000 and get a couple of fast chargers versus $1,000,000 to get a couple of fast chargers in there. It would be about 10 fast chargers, right. It's a big, huge difference in the total cost of ownership. So, Josh and Eric are paired at the hip to make that value prop out of our technology relate into what the customer really needs. But it's an industry that's just as its infancy. So, we're at the brink of saying, "Hey, think about this differently. Challenge how you're thinking about it, how governments want you to think about it, how it's being done today. There is a different way to do it if we just open our minds and think about it."

Josh Sobil: And I think if I can add to-just, this is an important topic because I think it's something relatively new. But it actually even in some ways for fleets or for even smaller vehicles, it even opens up more of the market for a lot of the OEMs. Because maybe a small customer that may only buy say five buses or something, they don't necessarily want to invest in putting a huge DC fast charger. So, they're either beholden to someone else installing a DC fast charger in an inconvenient location or they have to do the infrastructure investment themselves. So, to take a $120,000 fast charger and just reduce that down to say a $10,000 investment of a transformer and some switch gear, that could actually open up more some of these smaller players and make it more accessible, let's just call it, for the broader marketplace. So yeah, I just wanted to-we've seen so much traction on that. To use that word again.

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: That's your engineering side coming out, Josh.

Eric Hustedt: The other benefit is that the charging built into the drive scales with the battery. So right now, you might have a 400-volt charger, but if the battery systems go to 800 volts, you have to replace those fast chargers, whereas if you have the drive doing it then it's going to be natively paired with its battery. So, whether it's an 800-volt or even in the future 1200-volt batteries, it means you don't have to replace your DC fast charging infrastructure every time your battery voltage changes.

Josh Sobil: Yeah.

Darrell Bishop: That's true.

Sue Ozdemir: I think that, again, for you, for our shareholders, that's one of our key pillars as far as flexibility and design. And when we say flexibility and design, we don't mean the cliché “we're building a drive that's module or we're building something that's fast switching”. We mean truly flexibility in design to be able to grow and help our customers solve real issues that are coming out of the electrification movement. And so, I think that really is something that we do that nobody else is doing like we do.

Darrell Bishop: So, what I hear you saying is we're not a standard three-phase drive, right?

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: We're not a standard anything!

Darrell Bishop: So, we did have a question come in. I'm going to let you run loose on this one, Eric. "So, there's been some industry discussion around Bosch's new EV inverter. I understand it to be a very sophisticated standard three phase drive versus Exro's Coil Driver. Can you discuss?"

Eric Hustedt: Sure. I would say that it's a sophisticated marketing effort for a...

All: [laughter]

Eric Hustedt: …for a relatively normal three phase drive.

Darrell Bishop: Shots fired. shots fired.

Eric Hustedt: I don't see anything really remarkable about that product. It's just another three-phase motor and a three-phase drive in one box.

Sue Ozdemir: So maybe, Eric, since this is the first time shareholders are hearing from you directly, maybe give us three understandable super power electronic description. Three or four reasons: What differentiates the Coil Driver from good marketing or sophisticated marketing on a three-phase drive? What are some things in your design that you've done differently?

Eric Hustedt: So, first of all the Coil Driver itself, the coil switching capability gives you just really broad operating range on the electric machine. So, you have your low down torque, which usually requires a lot of amp turns, which is what the Coil Driver will do natively by switching into series mode. And then, when you want that power at high speed, the machine's producing a lot of back EMF now because you've got a large number of turns. So, we switch her into parallel mode and then all of a sudden, the back EMF has gone down by a factor of two. The inductance is reduced by a factor of four because it's an N squared relationship and same with the resistance. And now, you're operating the machine at a much higher RPM without having to be in field weakening, which is essentially non-torque-producing current. So, it just allows you to operate a machine very effectively for automotive applications. As an automotive car guy, I like the fact that it changes gears.

All: [laughter]

Eric Hustedt: It's a little bit cheesy maybe but it's interesting. I like that. Just from a personal perspective. I think the AC charging is a great addition because it just really makes the EV very flexible. Any outlet you can use to charge basically-and I think, maybe some of the regulations have to change around that a little bit, but it makes the charging infrastructure very simple because it's just essentially electrical infrastructure, which is already everywhere.

Sue Ozdemir: And, again, being that this is the first time that you're sitting in front of our shareholders-

Eric Hustedt: Uh oh.

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: as we think about the Coil Driver in particular-remember, when Eric joined the company in May 2020. May 2020?

Eric Hustedt: Something like that, yeah.

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah. We basically took the IP down to paper. And so, what we know today as the Coil Driver is Eric's expertise in design and development on the product, doing the same thing that Exro was meant to do as far as controlling motors or controlling batteries, but in a different way. And so, when I think about, for the non-engineers in our shareholder base listening in today, the ability to be able to gear, the ability to be able to control real world driving condition, the ability to design that, not buy out a bunch of components and assemble something-going back to the Bosch kind of-but really design the boards, the software, the hardware, all of that, I think, is really a unique piece of who we are as our DNA.

John Meekison: For sure, for sure.

Eric Hustedt: Just to be clear, I think Bosch is definitely designing everything in that drive themselves as well.

Sue Ozdemir: Yes, yes, we definitely want to clarify that.

Darrell Bishop: Just to switch gears a little bit, obviously all of our discussions so far has been geared towards the Coil Driver.

Eric Hustedt: Yeah.

Darrell Bishop: Probably because for shareholders we haven't talked a lot about or spoken a lot about, our Cell Driver, which is our stationary energy storage product. It's been by design for multiple reasons. First and foremost, I would say it hasn't been a significant resource focus internally, because we're leveraging our power electronics expertise from the Coil Driver into the battery control. But the last two days we've had a couple of really positive announcements that we're actually really excited about. I believe the energy storage has almost as much potential, if not more, than our Coil Driver. But with respect to the technology, Eric, does the Exro BMS include hardware or design features when the battery is first built, and can it accept various second life batteries?

Eric Hustedt: So, the BCS is definitely a hardware and a software product, right. So, we have some very complicated algorithms for estimating state of health and state of charge of cells. But fundamentally, it's not built into the battery. We can take any battery. It's essentially universal from a battery chemistry perspective, from a form factor perspective. So, the whole idea behind the system is literally that: to take any battery and allow a second life application. We use first life cells, and it extends the capability of those, but fundamentally its main capability is in second life, and we have a system-I don't know if we're allowed to talk about it?

Sue Ozdemir: You can talk about it.

All: [laughter]

Eric Hustedt: We have a prototype system up and running where we've actually got brand new cells matched with some very old, abused cells just to demonstrate the ability to mix cells. So, there's no reason we couldn't have two different manufacturer cells, two different capacities. That that was literally the purpose of this system, because as batteries age, their capacities diverge dramatically and being able to use those-

Sue Ozdemir: And to clarify just when I say we can talk about it. So, again-

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: To bring it back to what it means. It's not new news, just to be very upfront and transparent. So, what this is, like we've always been talking about, our BCS is agnostic to chemistry and it allows us to take first or second life, so we have the pilots working in Calgary. You follow on social media. We've shared some of the pieces come in, we're going to get better at sharing that. But like Eric's talking about, these are things that are working. Again, the product is not "is this going to work?" "Is this tech going to work the way we want?" It's "How do we commercialize it?" And now, as with today's announcement in our first step with Inferno here in western Canada, we're starting to make those steps. So that's what we're talking about with the pilots. It's how we utilize the one that he's referencing, where we have some old cells and some new cells, is with our partner evTS, where everybody knows that we were partnered with them to do the first life-sorry, the powertrain with the Coil Driver. But we also received some evTS battery cells that we were able to utilize into this pilot. Because it's a smaller vehicle you don't get a lot of those battery cells, so we match them up with cells from EVE, which is our first life supplier. And that allowed us to make this hybrid energy storage unit. So that's all in the same kind of concept of what we're doing with the BESS and the Cell Driver.

Darrell Bishop: And what gets me excited about the Cell Driver as well, it's a lot of things, including the tech. But when we think about the push to electrification, and we see the world going there, you pick a number: Is it 30% of vehicles on the road are electric by 2035? Is it 50%? The fact is we're going electric. And there's going to be a huge push to that. And we're seeing it already in terms of supply chain. What are going to be some of those big barriers? And if any of you own any battery metal stocks out there…

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: …in the last 10 months, you know what I'm talking about. And so, there's going to be a real supply crunch here when we look at 2025, 2026 and so on. And our ability to take a battery from a used vehicle, where it's reached end of life from a battery perspective but it's still 80% charge, and we can take it and pair it up with new batteries or put it in a system and control it at the cell level, it's really a differentiator in terms of technology there. And I want to be clear in terms of our target market here, we're not going after the residential market. We're going after commercial and industrial market, where it's a really under-serviced industry right now. And we're seeing that. We've been at recent tradeshows. I think you were at the RE+ conference a week ago. 800 booths there. And there were less than five that were focused on commercial and industrial. So, we really see a big market opportunity here and a differentiated technology to tackle that market.

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah, and-no, go ahead. Go Josh.

Josh Sobil: I was just going to say to add to that too, just bringing all of these electric vehicles and electrifying the economy in this way, the grid stability question comes up, which only requires more storage. So, the more vehicles you have, the more batteries you have. It's feeding on itself, essentially, that we can multiply this out, that if we can bring the cost curve down to storage the more ease we can have on the road, the more-and so on and so forth. So, it's going to affect that cost of storage globally and we're going to need more storage I guess is what I'm trying to say.

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah.

Eric Hustedt: Especially with DC fast charging, right? Grid operators really don't like, all of a sudden, a couple hundred kilowatts being pulled for like 20 minutes, and then it turns off again.

Josh Sobil: Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly right. Exactly.

Darrell Bishop: I'm going to keep you speaking, Josh. What is stopping giant corporations like Siemens-which Josh left Siemens to come to Exro, by the way-that have several decades of experience in power electronics from developing a Coil Driver?

Josh Sobil: I'm going to defer to Eric on that one.

All: [laughter]

Eric Hustedt: Yeah, I would say first of all is our IP. We've got a lot of IP, both awarded and pending, that is the core of our Coil Driver technology and a bunch of stuff that goes around it from an algorithm perspective, control perspective and all that sort of stuff. Secondly, we've invested three years at least in developing this. Solving all the little problems and ironing out all these little kinks. When there's brand new technology it's not straightforward to do. So, I would say the combination of those two things is really what protects us.

John Meekison: Yeah, it's really not easy just to go and turn on an engineering team of 100 people and immediately solve the problem, right?

Sue Ozdemir: And I think that it goes back to that very first question that we had, Darrell, about building those right people. It's not just about taking a team that's just sitting there. It's about developing over the last three years, of bringing in the right people that continue to evolve and accelerate that to market. And I think Eric's done that through our entire engineering team, which is more than 60 percent of Exro's employees right now.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah. Okay, a couple of fun questions. We're all car guys, by the way.

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: Including Sue. There's a Ford Mustang featured in an Exro bay in our Q3 report. Does that signal that Ford is actively testing the Coil Driver?

Sue Ozdemir: So, for those that have been a supporter of me for a very long time, you know that I'm honest about that kind of thing. So that's not what we're signaling. It says it in the fine print on the website. That doesn't mean that we're not working with OEMs like Ford. So, it's both sides. What it means is that particular vehicle is a vehicle that we purchased to do another demo with that would bring it into the passenger vehicle side. We had paused some of that as we looked and shifted and thought about where we used our capital to best project Exro. We will be building out that demo and what will be in it-we're waiting for the new motor-it's our new class one through three that allows us to demonstrate that passenger vehicle versus our Humvee vehicle. And so, Brian and the EVS team were part of that strategy. Again, it's not an overnight thing. It's something that's been in the works for probably over 10 months now. and so, it's sitting there waiting, waiting for its new electric Exro engine. That's an Exro demo fleet vehicle.

Eric Hustedt: And if we had it my way, that would be a rowdy [inaudible]

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: It'd be a tire slayer. It'd be a tire slayer for sure. Would you ever sell the Exro Humvee?

Sue Ozdemir: No. No. So, we have had lots of offers to buy our Humvee. For Josh, it's a great piece of being able to show it to customers. It's also a great piece for us to show as we do go out to look at where the future capital comes from. It's really a great demonstrator. It's a super vehicle to drive and it's definitely going to continue to evolve with us and we'll see lots more there. It's been traveling. So it's been in Detroit for the last several months. It's in Arizona now, and if you follow on social you know that I had a lot of fun trying to get that licensed. And so, the next one is, believe it or not, taking it in for an emission test, where obviously we don't need to do an emission test. But that will happen in the next several weeks as I prove that we have this electric Humvee. It's working fantastic and so, no, it's not for sale.

John Meekison: It is a lot of fun to drive.

Sue Ozdemir: It is a lot of fun.

Eric Hustedt: On a serious note, it's a nice testbed for us to get measurements from and gather a bunch of data. So, it does have its...

Sue Ozdemir: Yeah, it's going to be used. Think about it like a lab on wheels for Exro. So, as it goes out on the road, and it keeps giving us more log data, it allows Eric and Brian and all of the team to be able to look and see how we continue to fine-tune our algorithms, how we continue to just be better for our products of the future and what we want to see. So that is like Exro tech on wheels, on the road. And we do a lot of stuff with that behind the scenes that brings us phenomenal value. So, yeah. It's super cool though, so we won't sell it.

Darrell Bishop: So, all of these demos were obviously converting internal combustion vehicles to electric. Question came in regarding kits. Will we ever sell the electrification kits for like a Hummer or a Jeep? Obviously, there's big cult-like followings depending on application.

Sue Ozdemir: Right. So, what I will say is that bringing Brian onto the team-he's not here to join us. He was on our last update-is a big, key piece of how we take that core Exro tech, with our Cell Driver and our Coil Driver into extended products like kits, like mobile trailers, like different parts and pieces. And so, having Brian and the team able to use the software of the system, that component part of the vehicle and how we tie that software in is key. So, what I would say there is, while that's not our focus, it's definitely potential. And I would go as far as to say our next trade show is SEMA in Las Vegas, which is the specialty vehicle show. We'll be having our Humvee and our motorcycle there. We'll be launching a few things there. Brian and myself, and hopefully some of the team here in front of you will be there. And so, yes, that's definitely an option for the future. And timing and what that looks like I'm not going to talk to today.

Darrell Bishop: Okay. Two final questions. We're coming up on our hour here. John, maybe we can tag team this next one. And it's a question that we get often because we've been talking about it for a while, but-with all the macro-economic uncertainty, what is your timeline looking like in regard to NASDAQ uplisting?

John Meekison: Yeah, I think that's interesting. We're ready to go in the sense that we've gone through the application process. And so, we've been through a review and then we just put it on hold given what was happening in the overall backdrop of the financial markets. So, I would say I don't have a specific time table for that. If the world turns, interest rates go down and the markets are back, then I would say we're in a great position to move and execute very quickly. So hopefully sometime next year but we'll have to see how the world plays out.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah. And I guess I want to make sure that we emphasize to shareholders that we are 100% committed to following through on our NASDAQ listing. We want to make sure we're making decisions, again, that are in the best interest of shareholders at that particular time. Anyone that follows anything US, technology, NASDAQ related-especially a small cap-would know that NASDAQ would have been a brutal place to be through 2022. So, I'm fortunate-I've been here six months. And fortunate we weren't a NASDAQ company when I joined for that reason. There's a huge competition for assets right now. The competition for small cap assets has never been greater. So how do you stand out in the crowd? And from our perspective, it's really moving from being that speculative investment, a technology company that "hey this could be worth a lot of money someday" and we know Exro is. But really laying the track for shareholders and investors looking at the story to say "okay, here are the goal posts to revenue. Here's how you move from being a pre-revenue company to significant revenue in a relative short amount of time." And for shareholders, it's not just saying you can do it. It's giving that visibility. And that's what we're intent on doing with announcements like this morning, with recent purchase order announcements as well to continue to create that visibility and value for fundamental reasons for shareholders.

John Meekison: Yeah. And I would just add one other thing to that, Darrell. And that is, I think as Josh starts to deliver on the pipeline. Eric is delivering on the products to be able to fill into that pipeline. And Simon, who isn't here today, and is looking after the manufacturing and all of that. Our job from the financial standpoint is to be as flexible as possible and have as many options that are tools in our financial kit at our disposal. And that's what Darrell and I are always working on. We're always looking and making sure that we can react quickly to the current events as they unfold in the world and financial marketplace we're in.

Darrell Bishop: Agreed. Final question. And it's a question I'll throw out to everybody. I'll start with Eric.

Eric Hustedt: What?!

All: [laughter]

Darrell Bishop: Yeah. I know you love to be on the spot. And it's an important one. Why should shareholders believe in Exro?

Eric Hustedt: Well, the technology is fantastic. We've got a great group of engineers working on it, feverishly, that all believe in this technology, that all love it. But at the end of the day, the tech's [ __ ] awesome.

All: [laughter]

John Meekison: So that's what you meant.

Sue Ozdemir: Again, we're live so there's no beeping right now.

Eric Hustedt: Sorry about that.

Darrell Bishop: How about you, Josh?

Josh Sobil: Me? Demand.

Eric Hustedt: Keep it PG, please.

All: [laughter]

Josh Sobil: I say demand. We're seeing, first of all, an unprecedented growth in a marketplace that's absolutely enormous, for one. When you look at the traction space, not just on the automotive side, but off-highway is electrifying, commercial vehicles are electrifying, military is trying to electrify. It's across the board. We have places where we can plug ourselves in to markets that are growing at easily double digits across the board. And we're seeing the interest in the technology from customers. We're seeing a lack of capability coming from our competitors. So, for me this is part timing-maybe I shouldn't slag on that so much.

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: That's a Josh jab.

Josh Sobil: That's my jab out there. Yeah. But I think for me just from a commercial standpoint, the opportunity is immense. And it's unprecedented. In this industry there hasn't been a shift like this in a century, right. So, we're at the cusp of this and it's really just starting to ramp up right now.

John Meekison: Well, that's actually interesting how it segues from tech to demand. I think of it in terms of value. And I'm firmly convinced that this is a multi-billion-dollar company. And I appreciate that there is a bit of a disconnect between the share price and that. But I'm a buyer, I'm a shareholder. I continue to buy into the marketplace, and I am fully committed and believe that this is going to be worth a lot of money.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah. And that's my why as well. We get that the market, everything is a show me story right now. So, we need to execute, we need to deliver the tech, we need to deliver the orders, we need to finance the company to get there. But when I look at what's behind the glass, this is a state-of-the-art net-zero manufacturing facility. We're capable of producing a 100,000 Coil Drivers annually from one eight-hour shift. So theoretically, we can produce 300,000 units. Still a low volume manufacturing. That's everything from 100 volt up through 800 right now. Even if we just back down to our 100-volt drive, industry standard motor and drive in that range you're about a $1000 from a price point perspective. So, 100,000 units times a $1000, that's a hundred million dollars of annualized revenue. And so, we're intent on backfilling that. From an investor perspective, what value do you put on that? A hundred million dollars of annualized revenue-as Josh alluded to our contracts are not one point in time. They are multi-year sales agreements, and we can expand beyond this. And again, that's our low voltage. The high voltage drives, they sell industry motor and drive $20,000+. And so, that's all versus 100 million market cap today. So, when we look at it and see what is the meat on the bone here for shareholders with our execution, it is a multi-billion dollar company in all of our minds. And we know where the market is right now. We're going to keep our head down and execute for shareholders, but we're going to deliver it.

Sue Ozdemir: I get the last one, don't I?

All: [laughter]

Sue Ozdemir: I'm lucky that way. So, I will layer into that answer. So, I get asked a lot about what keeps me up at night, so I want to answer my why with what keeps me up at night. So sometime last year when we did one of our shareholder updates before we were doing the live ones, I said that it was the tech and keeping up fast. I think now that's not the case for me. And the reason for that is, as the world opened back up and we were able to go attend trade shows-whether it was the ACT show in May or the renewable energy show last week in California, Josh has done a couple shows in Europe, and then you were out at The Battery Show in Detroit-one thing that we really, really notice and has really validated our past two years-because it gets tough for us too. Watching that market price that doesn't reflect the value that we see inside and we're super excited to come to work every day, and then you see that share price and you're like "where's that disconnect?" So, for me what I really saw is, we are an absolute differentiator. As I look from powertrain to powertrain, there is nothing that does what our Coil Driver and what our Cell Driver is going to do for the energy storage unit. So that is not keeping me up at night anymore. I'm sleeping quite well these days. It's obvious what keeps us up at night as publicly traded companies, so I don't need to talk to that. So, I think my why is twofold. It's the differentiating value of our product and the fact that we're de-risked as a product. And we've got hard work ahead of us, no doubt about it. And smart people that are going to do that. And that ties to my final. It's not just me who believes in Exro. There are over 100 employees that work hard every day, and I can say nothing but thank you to all of the work-from there's somebody behind this camera with Arman right now, there's Mo from our marketing team who works day and night, and when I left at six o'clock last night with the team, he was still here with an entire marketing team. And so, there's people that are here every day that believe in this vision with me, and I never want to take that for granted. It is the people behind Exro that are taking this and making a difference. It's our shareholders, it's our suppliers that are giving us a chance when we are an underdog in the world of Bosch, and others, and Borg, and others that are playing. It is our partners like Linamar, and SEA Electric, and Vicinity, and evTS, and Zero, and others that believe in what we're building and are willing to go through those hills and valleys of taking tech to market. But all of that happens because of people. And behind Darrell, John, Josh, Eric, and myself, and Simon, and Brian, and Spyros-who aren't here with us on the panel today-is a hundred employees that are making it happen every single day. So, my why is definitely everything that we see here, but it's the people that are helping me to build this, and so thank you to everybody.

Darrell Bishop: Yeah. Thank you everybody for answering questions. Just want to reiterate again to shareholders. We didn't get to all of your questions. We are committed to answering those, posting them online. Anyone can go in on our website and see all the questions there. So, we're not shying away from anything, we're being transparent. And hope everybody has a great day. Thank you.

Sue Ozdemir: Thank you.

John Meekison: Thanks, everybody.

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